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Young Gay Blogger: Gay Men Over 30 Should Stay Out Of The Clubs

A blog post from late last week has been making the rounds on social media, and igniting a firestorm of comments in its wake. Titled "Gay Men & The Curse of the Peter Pan Syndrome," the editorial posted to GayGuys.com by writer Dalton Heinrich asserts that gay men "are absolutely horrible when it comes to growing up."

Because of this, Heinrich prescribes gay men 30 and up one simple task: stay out of gay bars and clubs.

Nobody bats an eye when a straight male in his adult prime is at a bar or club hitting on younger women, so what's Heinrich's deal?

He writes:

Since the beginning of my social existence a large portion of my friends had been older than myself. I had always just assumed that I was mature for my age when in actuality I think most of the gay men I associated with had never mentally passed the age of 25. From boyfriends, to just friends, to acquaintances, to people I would repeatedly bump into at gay bars; a large portion of them were at a dead end when it came to maturing.

Why is it a social norm of ours to be in our late forties and going clubbing and bar hopping multiple times a week? Of the hundreds of grown men I know, why are so few of them actually grown up? Was I doomed to a life of bottle service and boyfriends half my age because I couldn’t settle down and start a family at an appropriate time. 

...

It is as if all gay men are terrified to grow up. The abundance of thirty and forty something’s that attend nightclubs persistently and dress like they are going to a college frat party is astounding. Instead of the Botox, barhopping and H&M wardrobes; why as a culture, are the majority of us not having children and planning our futures.

...

The sad, thirsty man haunting the shadows of 18 and up clubs is slowly killing our culture. When my generation of gays gets older are we going to think that is the normal thing to do with our nights? Are we all destined to be ghosts of our youth, dramatically hunting down a thrill rather than being man enough and brave enough to go toward the light and move on to actually being an adult?

I think it is time to fight off this trend of a permanent youth. We all need to realize how to act our age and how to play our part in our community. It is time to be a role model for the next group of young men. It is time to tell Peter Pan that you want to go home and as much as it may not be the funniest thing to do, it is time to grow up.

What do you think about Heinrich's advice for gay men older than 29? (Read his full editorial here.)

(h/t: Wicked Gay Blog)

 

Comments

Yeah right.. bars will go out of business.18 year olds have no money

I only have one thing to say to this young boy. You will be over 30 one day, so put yourself in the over 30 man's shoes. How are going to like it when you get told the same thing?

This again? This is an old article.

This bloke needs a good talking to, What a load of bullshit he talks. Ageist bullshit. He needs to go out on the Str8 scene as well. Now people are going out and having a good time at older ages they are newly single people or people who's kids have left home. Yes Straights are doing it to. As for my Gay, Bi and Trans brothers, why shouldn't we go out and have fun its nothing to do with a Peter Pan complex at all! 

Trouble with alot of the chickens (younger guys) is that they have no idea or perception of how it used to be for a lot of us guys over 40, where in our younger days going out to gay bars was a huge risk. Often blacked out bars or windows boarded up as they have too many bricks thrown through them. 

Who the fuck do you think fought hard to get you these bars, these safe places to drink in, these safe places for stand there and cast your judgement on the older guys who were probably far braver then you ever will be. 

Who owns these bars oh yes gay men in their 30s, 40s 50s etc who got off their arses and started up a business who work long hours so you can go out and have fun.

Also please remember many of our friends and loved ones are no longer here, we lived through not only homophobia and transphobia but also the HIV/AIDS crisis which took many of our friends, Theres not a gay man over 40 who hasn't lost a friend to HIV so we deserve the right the go out and have fun to party and enjoy ourselves without some jumped up young man telling us where we can and can't go. You need to be grateful to us older guys if anything.

HI,

I just stumbled across this blog by chance and read above. WELL SAID! is all I can add to what you wrote on 20th June. I actually couldn't have put it any better. It would appear that by today's standards one (gay male) should commit Seppuku (Hara-kiri) by the time they aproach or reach 40.

Well, I don't think so. I've just turned 54 and I have no intention of doing such a thing, I mean, killing myself and no, I don't have a Peter (who?) syndrome. Interestingly, hardly any one believes me when I tell my age, and I believe that's simply because I don't give two hoots about mine, I try to live my live to the best I can. Those people who are horribly critical of older gays are the ones who suffer the most as there is one thing they can't control: I mean, you can wear prada all you like, be the über hipster in town, have plastic surgery, anything you like! It;s all there for the taking (so long you can afford it that is) but your body is going to age no matter what. Besides, I would love to see them try to cope when they realise they are reaching that horrifying age (OMG, I'm almost forty! I can hear them scream). I would love to show that guy this article in 10years time to find out how he feels about it. 

I was in WeHo for two hours on Sunday and it was embarrassing. This story has some good points. I don't drink (that often) or do drugs at all and the place was crawling with burned out guys and girls much younger then me who looked tragic. The LA Sherrifs dept main goal was to make sure these meth heads didn't get run over by cars and to alert paramedics if someone has overdosed... It's sad... Can I find a good looking gay man in his 30's or 40's who isn't a mess in LA??? Probably not... I'm requesting a transfer to SF or Seattle.

Sorry, but if I had MY way, I'd say keep the younger twinks from bringing their fag-hags to the clubs and turning EVERY remaining (supposedly) gay bar into a sorority party where obese, drunk hags take turns twerking in front of their gay friend who invited them.  I get that times have changed and gays can go anywhere/are not confined to gay clubs or "the gay ghetto", but it would be NICE to have one place where guys can just be (with) guys.

Well, that's nice dear. You said something and released it into the atmosphere. Iwish to you is when you turn 30 karma bitch slaps you hard.

Hope this little WeHo twirp gets run over by a float today!

Ageism. One could just as easily advise gay men UNDER 30 to keep out of the bars and hit their college text books, find a church, and pick up some community service to EARN a place in society before relaxing at a club with a drink. Maybe it's the irrational and misguided high premium our culture places on youth that generates the gay male 'immature' ageing types this guy laments. And maybe he found himself so often surrounded by said types as a function of his own immaturity and shallow values. I certainly never had the same problem. As a young gay man, I had older friends AND younger friends. We all had a blast. And those older friends? They were excellent role models with respectable lifestyles and positions in society. I would prescribe a humanities-heavy curriculum for this poor soul. Couldn't hurt. His grievance is really just his own ageist wishes disguised as a concern for gay culture. He thinks fun, music, drinking, dancing, and socializing is for the young only (because only they deserve it?) and that's all there is to his post. I'm annoyed at myself for even acknowledging that I read this article. But ageism in our culture is a real issue.

I have to agree also, I didn't start going to the bars until I was in my mid 30's. I was to busy being young and having fun to hang out in the bars looking for a sugar daddy.

I couldn't agree more....and don't be annoyed, your honesty is spot on.  Role models are in dire need for all ages and thinking before he speaks... "blogs" ...would be a great place for him to start!

As an 18 year old (nearly 19!) gay male, I hope I'm still hitting Manchester gay village when I'm 30 and beyond. Perhaps I won't have the energy to stay in Void Nightclub until 9am anymore, but since when did I decide at my age now who can come in and who can't? In Manchester we have one of the safest, yet most fun and famous Gay Villages in the world that was built up by a generation way before mine. A little respect for said generation might not go amiss? The only thing that really bothers me is when 50 year old guys chase me because i'm pretty and blonde ;) However, the ageism that you are perpetuating is wrong.

aha I am 46 and still go out on Canal Street and can still be out to the early hours. Not every week but once in a while lol.

This idiotic "editorial" has been making the rounds since last fucking August. By now, it's just a pathetic piece of click bait. Please stop linking to it.

WHO DO YOU THINK OWNS THE CLUB YOU LITTLE QUEEN?!  GET THE FUCK OUT OF OUR CLUBS YOU LITTLE SISSY BITCH!

Or, perhaps, "Get off my club's lawn, you little, sissy bitch."

Oh please!  She's on the blog, just desperate to make her 15 minutes of fame..  Give it up Cinderella, you wouldn't have a fucking club if it weren't'  for your forefathers.  Maybe you should just stop going out with the butt plug up your ass once in a while.

she's just having her period

To the 'young gay blogger':

Perhaps if you didn't spend all YOUR time on and around the gay scene, you'd realise that the majority of gay men spend most of their social time elsewhere. If you WERE mature, you'd realise that age should be no barrier to wearing whatever you like and partying away, if that's what you want to do. Or, you could give in and behave exactly how society has programmed you to be. Try to be the heterosexual stereotype, desperately trying to be 'normal'.

I really don't care if it offends your immature eyes to see flesh older than 29 years of age. Grow up! Oh the irony... wink emoticon There is more to life than the 12 years between 18 and 29!

Besides which, what is left of the gay scene would collapse if those aged older than 29 stopped using it... and it's those older gay men that fought for... and won... all those rights that YOU now take for granted. The phrase, 'immature, naive & ungrateful brat' springs to mind...

I respect his opinion but it is only that ,an opinion. Stupid but an opinion non the less.

I don't respect his opinion. I respect his right to have one insofar as I wouldn't want to see him lynched for expresssing it. But his opinion is lame.

When I read the blog, I really don't think the intention of what he's saying is that men over 30 should not go to the clubs or bars at all. I think the intention is that there's more to life than going to the club, as he called out going to the club persistently multiple times each week. I think, however, he's missing the historical background. Historically the gay bar or club was the only place where gay men could be themselves. It was the only place to escape from the intolerance that kept them from living their lives openly. The acceptance that we see in today's world is relatively new and sometimes taken for granted by the gay youth. History has dictated that it is the "norm" for gay men to "live" at the club. But as times change, we as a community can change as well. But it really has nothing to do with age. No matter if you're in your 20s, 30s, 40s, and so on, there's more to life than being at the club multiple times each and every week. Live a life bigger than just the club. Have kids if you want, don't if you it's not for you. Go to the club if you want, don't if it's not for you. But also go out and experience all the other things life has to offer: art, theater, museums, nature, outdoors, whatever interests you may have. Expand your world beyond the gay clubs, beyond only gay friends or "fag hags." This is what all the struggles were for, so that we as a community could live open lives and not be tied to a stereotype or a historical "norm." It's so we can live our lives openly and not have our lives dictated by anyone or any group. 

Well put. I appreciate the fact that you took this opportunity to enlighten people, rather than bashing the author of an unpopular opinion.

I may not be 30 yet but I would never discriminate against anyone because of their age. Most of my close friends are past that age.On top of that, this guy claims to be so "mature" but the reality is that he's stuck up and has some major growing up to do.

To add to my comment, as others mentioned, acceptance for just being gay has been a long enough problem but now to be discriminating against your fellow gays really is so wrong.

The situation that comes to mind is the recent boom of acceptance in the gay community. These people probably weren't able to flaunt all of their true nature back in their days so they're enjoying themselves now. And I don't think it's sad but admirable for a person over 30 to be out in gay bars enjoying themselves but it may be true that there are the type of gay guys above 30 that are still stuck in their youth, not fully maturing, possibly due to the lack of acceptance they had back in their day or for some other reason completely, eitherway, a gay bar is a gay bar, old or young, this person is not one to criticize the general population of gay people over 30 because even if they might just seem immature, best to help out their situation that just tell them to stop going to bars so you won't have to deal with the thought of how their "immaturity" seems sad to you. But that's just how I see what the guy's trying to get across, maybe he's immature and doesn't see deeper into the life of these people in their 30's to think they're immature. Just hope he'd have put more thought into the article 'cause it seems so one sided.

I think you hit the hammer on the nail, the recent boom of acceptance of the gay community and the increase in gay friendly media & advertizing. Lack of acceptance also troubles hooking up in permanent partnerships. Will future generations end up earlier on the couch, resembling their straight neighbors? Less Bars, more BBQs?  

As Joan would say "OH,  GROW UP HINEYLICK!!!" does this person really think that any of us 30 and over would see him as a mature individual? I think not. Hopefully, this clubber will make it past the ripe old age of 30 ( LOL). I would love to follow up with him if and when he reaches age 50, Then see what his perspective is on this topic!

My thoughts exactly. Let's see if this punk has a different story when he's 40-50, even 60. These young kids have no clue what it was like for us a few years ago. It's like the cell phone and cyber - dating/hookups. For those not yet 30 it's always been there for them. We fought hard for the right to even HAVE a gay club so pardon me if I push your ass out of my way to get a well deserved space at the club!

my thoughts exactly and ironically its probably an older gay guy who owns the bar that he goes to!

WHY? WHY ban gay men over 30 from bars? People are allowed to do what they want!

You're afraid of the image of gay men? Don't follow their path! I don't go to bars and I'd like to have a family! What if they don't? What if they prefer to enjoy themselves and not get involved in a long, expensive and delusive process to have their family?

You will find plenty of suitable and nice guys that want to be parents, but not in bars and clubs!

So my advice? Leave bars and clubs to clubbers and start searching for someone that will suits your expectations and stop going out in clubs yourself! you are right, you might not find the right person there!!

I hear fear from a lost boy- terrified of 'growing up' alone with nothing of 'value' to him. Dalton has an expectation of life at an older age based on his own development and socialisation. He poses various questions suggestive of a unconscious need for love and guidance. Mostly notably to me, 'Why are there so few gay men in my life that look at the next generation as someone to mentor and coach rather than a new addition to their dating pool? It feels clear to me that Dalton is saying that he doesn't feel safe and nurtured in his community. Having no 'parental figure to aspire to be' it must be frightening to be considered a potential "mate" by a generation of gay men that you expect to 'mentor' and 'coach' you through life. Dalton couldn't personally know the true agony and the blinding rage of everything that encompassed the AIDS epidemic and the fight for gay rights. While Daltons ignorance has clearly insulted and offended many gay men in their 30s and beyond" he is only projecting his worries, fears and insecurities of growing up in his world and in his community. Ignorance is born out of a preoccupation with the self, to be so encapsulated by ones life because it stands as a barrier until you figure your way out to a world of others which opens doors to learning of the history of the now. Like many of young men and women in their 20's Dalton hasn't left his capsule and there should be an allowance for that. Dalton's material may only be offensive if you chose to take it personally. Throwing insults, rejecting his young and fragile sense of self and condemning him for his ignorance I don't believe is fair. Especially by a community of which he is asking to love and nurture him. The real problem here is a lack of empathy and understanding of human beings regardless of anything else... How can anyone learn that if this is how we communicate!? 

I wanted to be fair before commenting, so I read a couple of his other blog articles. In "Bitchslapped on Grindr," dated January 2014 (8 months prior to publication of this masterpiece), Heinrich laments about having been blocked on said app because the man whose attention he sought wasn't into "femmes." He next lists, with deep concern about the bigotry of his fellow man, several "discriminations" he typically sees on these sites (body type, race, dick size, etc., but nowhere does he mention ageism) and vows to counter these injustices by becoming more inclusive of the poor souls he has so haughtily rejected. I guess the hypocritical little brat embraces the pulpit but loathes the commitment.

One more thing. I'm 59 - don't feel it, look it, think it or act it, so you can accuse me of Peter Panning through my middle years all you like - I'll proudly agree. I used to be you, Mr. Heinrich, posing and primping in clubs, until I turned 28 and met a wonderful man 5 years my senior. Hewas the love of my life, but we couldn't marry; it wasn't legal back in those days. We spent much of our 30's watching our friends die. After 27 years, 6 years ago, he lost his battle with liver illness. Now, after years as caregiver and mourning, I've emerged from my shell. I'm in a new relationship with a younger man I met a few years ago in India. He's not a twink like you, Mr. Heinrich; he has a maturity beyond his years. I’m living life again, Mr. Heinrich, doing things I've always dreamed of doing: skydiving, mountain climbing, circumnavigating the globe, producing plays, etc. I’m joined by my new companion and others of all ages, even as young as you, in these pursuits – the more the merrier. But even if I did choose to hang out in bars, and very occasionally I might - what of it? I've earned the right to do what I want as long as I don't hurt anyone. You, Mr. Author of Entitlement, have not earned the right to harmfully dictate how anyone should or shouldn't behave. There may be more youth in these old bones than you can ever capture in a selfie, so I ask, "Could the bitter old queen you fear so much be YOU?"

Kudos to you for writing this!! I am 60 and was not as lucky as you to have found a partner as early as you did.I am now with the most incredible man and I now have the right to marry which we are going to do very soon. I too had to watch my entire circle of friends die so can totally relate to your pain there. I no longer go out to clubs and bars but if the urge took me I'd go regardless of this little twits views. How sad and shallow his life must be compared to ours with all we've been through. All strength to you!!

I love this comment so much!!

Thank you for posting it!

Well Said! I Applaud You! Life is what WE make it and don't need anyone to dictate how we should live. OUR choice. Best to You!

Having toured the country many times and been in gay bars  of all types, all over the place for many decades, it is amazing to me to hear the pontificating from one of our own...He speaks so glaringly of maturity...Before he has the essence of that..Perhaps he sees himself projected into age and at this young place doesn't want to think of himself in this scene..A young one assumes and projects purpose into older gents...I did ...Some are predatory and some aren't....But that is true at any age..To set a LOGAN'S RUN confinement on age or purpose is in itself immature..And NO one especially a gay colleagues has the right to be so judgmental about a bar scene. We are all among our own in what should be a safe place...Not another place where we are targets...and in this case of our own people?  Is this kid a LOG CABIN REPUBLICAN elitist? Could be ..but even so...Why are we in a Bar...To see and be seen..>To cruise and flirt...to check out the competition? To perhaps get a date and some sexual release and some physical sharing. Like in any Goddamn bar -- straight, gay, biker, cowboy, or sophisticated high brow.   I hope as others commented that this guy gets to be aged and wisened...And yes WE of an age set the pathway and smoothed the road....And Yes when some didn't live through AIDS onset and the persecution of years past and STONEWALL  perhaps they should have. Going to Rallies  in Central Park and Marches for RIGHTS...Watching friends and lovers crumble and die...Watching and joining ACT UP  and making a real difference ..And the corruption of a Reagan administration that denied HELP and medical needs to AIDS patients...The meanest policies that made us face the horrors...with No recourse but to ENDURE...So my young friend physical beauty and youthful pride is a joy to wallow in but it is temporal ..Why those of us who were spared the torturous physical demise of our friends and loved ones I am still contemplating...But I am sure it was not to hear the scolding voice of this fellow ...We EARNED the right to any BAR or Gay haunt ..You my boy, are mere visitor...As we once were...EMBRACE IT ALL WHILE YOU CAN....With more heart !
 

PREACH.

I wonder if the little brat has time in her life for marches and rallies or is she too busy primping and posing in the bars?

Clueless little twat. Learn your DAMNED history!

This little fuck has no idea that the freedom he enjoys today is because of what  gay guys 2 and 3 times his age had to go up against. I'm 55, and I'm one of a handful of friends left from my era because of a disease which ravaged our community. Today these guys can take a pill and act as if nothing ever happened. We paved the way for future generations and this little ungrateful prick has the nerve to act as if he is so righteous. Guys like this will always take shit for granted and never have to struggle with freedom, death by the thousands, actual fear for our lives and safety. The challenges we overcame paved the road so this little boy just might have a chance. Too bad he is so closed minded and biased. I pity him. He'll never know what it takes to overcome adversity, having everything already done for him. And he too, will be older one day, and I bet my last dollar he'll regret this some day.

I must agree. These young guys today have no idea what we have had to endure so that they may enjoy being themselves today. I am 58 now and remember the harassment for being gay, losing my job for being gay. But I just like many others continued on holding our heads high proclaiming we are gay and we demand our rights like every other human being. Just wait till he reaches his maturity.

calm down ... we were all young once ... and now we're old(er) ... his destiny is the same :-)

I hope this twink lives as long as i have and then we will see him talking out the other side of his ass. My MASTER and i go out and are always treated with respect- HE is 61, i am 56. when this twink losses that youth i want to be alive to hear him whine!

You won't be young forever, sweetie, and you entitled little bastards really piss me off. You weren't born able to just drop into a gay bar, march in parades, keep a job (which sometimes you still actually can't), get married, etc. WE fought the battles for you and the generations to come. Are you even aware of how we were considered "deviants", subject to entrapment and arrest and considered to be mentally ill? WE fought and changed things. We did the heavy lifting and you little ungrateful fuckers take all this for granted. My club days are over and I patronize a more suitable bar to those of my age. But I'll be damned if a little prick like you will tell me I can't or shouldn't go to a particular place because of my age. In fact I'm lucky to have made it to this age (55) because everyone around me was dying during my 20's. Can you even get your pretty head around that, cupcake? So shut up and shake your ass anywhere you want. I don't care. But remember why you are permitted to do it.

It's his opinion.I disagree with it.  He hasn't any more business telling me whether or not I "should" be going out than Ann Coulter has telling me I shouldn't be gay.  Ah it reminds the of the arrogance of my youth, such a stupid little know-it-all

Who the hell does he thinks OWNS those clubs? What a twit. 

I could give a shit what some kid says, I plan to dance and drink until I die and I'm 51 so I have many more decades to continue to have fun. :)

BTW I find it HILARIOUS that this kid is all clutchy the pearls about being "appropriate" .... when did the gays (and the lesbians for that matter) give a flying fuck about being 'appropriate'?

I feel sorry for him, he's so filled with rage and self-loathing and worse, he has untold 'fans' who think just like him. I'd like to see the blog post he writes in 20 years because the schadenfreude will be incredibly entertaining. :)

Will Clark, you forgot to add you're sexy as hell, too... At 40, I look better than I did at 30 (though you did insist at Porno Bingo my name was Michael and we had hooked up before to which I should I have responded, "If you'd like to we can..." but I was being a gentleman)... anyway before this train takes off from St. Olaf, I will say this in that twit's defense... he is young.  He is taking his place in this world for granted. Unless he wakes up and realize that soon time will pass him by and he will realize it has also passed all over his face. There are things you can get away with when your age starts with a 2 that you cannot pull off when that number begins with a 3, 4, 5, and more without people looking at you with a look of "WHAT THE FUCK ARE YOU DOING?"  I should know, I still get those looks to this day.

Age, ultimately, is just a number.  It is not the defining factor of who I am.  As I am fond of saying, "I am a white male of Judeo Christian descent... all of the world problems were caused by people like me..."  I'm 40.  I'm gay.  I'm a former rugby player.  I'm a white collar professional.  I'm a lover of adventure travel.  I'm a bourbon enthusiast.  I'm a roller derby referee.  I'm a really bad cook.  I'ma teller of wholly inappropriate jokes.  I'm a mean massage therapist.  

Life is too short to be telling other people what the fuck they can do with their lives.  In the immortal words of Jerry Herman: 

I am what I am
And what I am needs no excuses
I deal my own deck
Sometimes the ace
Sometimes the deuces

There's one life
And there's no return and no deposit
One life, so it's time to open up your closet
Life's not worth a damn till you can say
"Hey world, I am what I am"
 

Ok, first of all F you!!! Second of all, I live in a relatively small town that has only one gay bar. With that being said, where the hell do you suppose thirty, forty, and even older gay men go? Around my neck of the woods "most" gay men don't go to straight bars/clubs in fear of being gay bashed....  Third of all what are you going to do when your up in years??? I'd say that 99% of my gay friends are in their thirty's or older, and their some of the best people that I've ever met! One final thing.... How the hell old are you?!?!?!?!?!?!?

It's a 'generation thing'!  ...every young generation likes their own age (except for some daddy / sons out there --- but for the most part - 30, 40, 50 year olds are taboo to the young ones.  This applies at the clubs, in public, etc...  UNFORTUNATELY, they'll all face the same curse when they turn those ages and nobody wants THEM in the clubs!  They don't realize that the older crowd still 'feels' 21 and has the knowledge and experiences that they could learn from.  (SIGH) -- they'll learn the hard way!  Meanwhile --- I'll go to ANY CLUB I want to..screw them!   :-)

I don't think that statement that every young generation likes their own age is actually true. I think there are a huge number of guys in their 20s and 30s who like guys in their 40s and 50s. And not just as a sugar daddy.

I think Heinrick needs to stop worry about what everyone else is or isn't doing and focus on himself.  He can start a family if he wants, but it's obvious that he still wants to be the party boy with daddy issues.  I do agree that it can be creepy for older men to be stalking younger men, but if the guys are all consenting adults, who the fuck cares?  I know plenty of younger men that don't want to have anything to do with their peers and only seek the company of old men and vise versa.  And bars would make a grave mistake by rejecting patrons based on age (despite the fact that it's illegal), since older people have more free money.  Heinrick is obviously showing the ignorance of his youth, and I'm sure that, once he turns 30 and 40 and 50 and maybe even 60, he'll have different feelings when someone he meets at a bar shuns him for just being there...or at least I hope so.

I never in my life met ANYONE of Quality or Substance in a Bar. Obviously Heinrich needs to Grow Up & Manage his Control Issues Privately!

Read- The Velvet Rage.

Matty, I referenced this book in my original post. It's awesome!

Well I am 39 and I see all you 30 or less more worse off than higher age people are? So maybe it should be 30 or less that needs to be going to the Bars, Because your 10 times worse!

Ban gay men over 30 and watch the bars closing under bankruptcy. The author of this blog is an idiot. 

Someone has not yet found MenOver30.com.

"why as a culture, are the majority of us not having children and planning our futures"

Having children? Really? You honestly think that should be my goal?  Says the 20-something guy who spends all his time hanging out in bars? Do YOU want kids? Yeah? Great! But I don't and its nothing to do with being immature. In fact it has to do EXACTLY with being mature and making the mature adult decision that I do not want kids, not because I want to fritter away my days with endless parties. Far from it! The same way lots of straight people decide they don't want kids. You couldn't sound like a bigger hetero-normative chump if you tried.

I wouldn't be caught dead in a bar. Went a few times in my early 20s and thought "this is NOT my scene." and promptly made my own life filled with different goals and dreams-but I wouldn't decry those who do enjoy them as being sad or less than me-some people enjoy the social interaction and community bars and clubs provide. Its also only a small part of what YOUR life can be. What about the museums? What about making music? What about going to the theater? What about traveling to cool places you've never been? What about following creative endeavors? What about Gardening? What about visiting the beach for tidepooling excursions? What about learning to cook? Or going on gorgeous hiking trips? What about falling in love? What about growing old together? What about burying your lover who dies of an aneurysm and leaves you alone at 29? The naive lack of awareness, of life's myriad complex experiences seems utterly lost on this writer. He is in a bubble and so thinks that is the limit of what life has to offer. In middle age, he will be miserable because then he'll be an older gay man who hates himself even more than he does now. Or maybe he will have the luck to pull his head out of ass. 

Google Dalton Heinrich....and a link will come up titled (not exact words) "what the asshole meant when he said guys over 30......:

He tries to defend his statements, and say he was not referring to anybody, but making a general statement. I don't see that......he is very specific and points the finger at all of us by referring to anyone over the age of 30. This guys immaturity was confirmed, and now well documented. What a fucktard!!

I love going to our local gay club and meeting with friends. Socializing is a need for all humans to know that they are alive. I am not looking for anything but friends...if something comes of that friendship then all the merrier. To say that we are letter pan syndrome is a crock of shit. I say "live life to the full every day of your life and screw those that think otherwise."

"Don't try to win over the haters; you're not the jackass whisperer." -Scott Stratten

Who would pay for their drinks?

Bars would close so fast!  I could not afford to drink out all the time in my 20's, in my 30's and 40's I have great job and good pay.  I can afford to go out more now than when i was that young.  I don't personally do it very often but this youngster needs to realize that the gay bar is a central hub for many people of differing ages and without the income from the old gentlemen most of the bars would be closing their doors and the youngsters would not have a gay bar to go to.

"Was I doomed... because I couldn’t settle down and start a family at an appropriate time?"

What a sadly conventional ass! Why was this hidebound jerk even so widely listened to?

Never heard such tripe in my life and as a 35 yr old man, it'll be a cold day in hell before I justify what I do or how I live my life to another one of those arrogant bitchy queens I'm sooooo glad o shook off at the end of my 20's.

His insecurity is the sole reason for his attitude. Pity don't hate. S xx

Dalton Heinrich, the author of this blog,  needs to rethink his immature attitude.  When he sees a gay man over 30 or 40 or <gasp> 50, he needs to walk up to him, shake his and and say "Thank you".  Thank you for having the courage to be gay in a time when it wasn't "in" to be gay.  Thank you for standing up, not just to bullies but to police raids, evictions, employment terminations, and psychiatric hospitalizations. Thank you for demanding that our families stop being treated like second class citizens.  Thank you for REFUSING to remain silent as a disease ravaged our community and the government did nothing.  When he sees a gay man over 30, he is not seeing an old troll, he is seeing a survivor...a pioneer...a hero.

Right on -from a lesbian perspective. Listen guys, you're not the only ones who have to listen to or read this sort of tripe from the youngsters around us. We gals ('scuse me, SOLs -slightly older lesbians) get it, too. We roll our eyes, just as you slightly older guys are doing right now, and tell these young shits to be happy for what they have -it came at a cost. Guess who paid it? Yeah, the toll was paid forward by the very people he now wishes to exclude from his gay little world -emphasis on "little". So STFU and dance, you ignorant young blogging troll, and try to remember the world DOES NOT revolve around you. Try to remember next time to think before you spew.

AMEN brother!

Spot on Allen! As a 48yo gay man that came out at 16, I was all too familiar with being bullied and terrorized. This young man has so much self-hatred. Poor soul.

The "author" knows nothing of his own people's history, completely ignorant of HIS history as an LGBTQ member of society. As a 50 year old gay guy I am torn between hoping he realizes how wrong he is or being so thankful he lives in a world so wonderfully changed from 30 years ago that he can even have these ridiculous opinions. The change in our culture is astounding and maybe some find it difficult to grasp that the opportunities available today are NEW and not to be taken for granted. Many generations of LGBTQ have toiled, worked, fought, and been murdered to make our quality of life possible. Many of us have no desire whatsoever to become an homogenized version of a human being. The LGBTQ society is vast and multi-layered. May that never change. I thank every person before me who helped make my quality of life possible and made sure I know our work is not over. Peace to us all.

Allen, you are right on! I don't think anyone could have posed it any better than you did! Thanks Allen!

All of you under 30 motherfuckers are crazy. I am 42 years old and gay. I do not attend bars and night clubs because that isn't my thing. BUT if I should decide that I want to go and shake my ass at the club with my friends I am GODAMNED going to. Fuck you young motherfuckers that think young people are the only ones who deserve to have fun and enjoy themselves around other gay people. You younger queers need to learn some fucking respect for those of us that have been around through the years dealing with the bullshit that people like us have been faced with since people started to walk upright and attend churches. Instead of causing animosity people age groups why don't you motherfuckers try to embrace all ages, hell we are ALL fighting the same fucking fight out there.... 

young ones only want sex or to try and date as many as they can, they dont know what true loyalty is nor do they even care they just want to have fun well i can dance as well if not better than most of them can and dont have to try as hard

I have to say though, there is something quite soul destroying when you see a thirty-something gay man in a fashionable night club, wearing clothes that are too young for him and trying to convince himself he enjoys the loud and offensive music youth today listen to. 

I think this journalist isn't targeting all gay men over thirty, but the ones who are desperately trying to live a lifestyle that doesn't suit there age. Coming from a performing arts background, a "normal" nine-to-five job is alien to me, and the life that some men of that age is a dream to me. However, you then see people in my profession when they hit past thirty, and they haven't got a lot to show for themselves because they've been living the "rockstar" lifestyle.

This writer, like most of us when we're young, lives in fear of being that single, penniless old guy at the bar with crows feet and a receding hairline - Cinderella going to a ball every Saturday in Soho which they really need to stop attending.

If it weren't for us older guys and trust me I have so many young ones after me you lil punks would actually have to get a real job  we older guys spend a lot of money on you young guys that's why 90 percent of you have no work ethic  or real job   Trust me princess you need us older guys.  As a man in his mid 40s I look and dance better than most 20 year olds that's why I can have about any twink I want plus I have a real job and make good money so before you put on your tiera think about what comes out of your in need of dental service mouth. K honey 

Lol as a 23 year old you're pathetic for doing that and feeding their problems.  They're just taking advantage of you.

Amen!    I have kids already but enjoy going out once in a while.   I may be over 40 but im not dead

Well, least to say is this...1st we had straight people stereotype us..now we are stereotyping ourselves based on age arrangement group. So, to quote what he is saying is that none of age 30 plusers are smart and we are all stupid!?!

P.S. Fact check, all 30+ gay usually have good paying jobs..so this guy would like us not to spend our money at his bar. Ok fine dudeass have it your way and be broke and bankrupt in short amount of time with that business principle.

so lets get this straight(ish)  if someone doesnt come out until they are over x years old they should stay at home and rot in a corner ? 

get a grip child and remember what youre saying when youre at this age and people are poking you with a sharp stick

at 48 why the hell should i stop going out just because a jumped up child hasnt got his shit together. if we didnt create a gay scene the children would be so far in the closet now they would be Narnia

well then the twinks wont be getting anymore free drinks

Well, overconfident young pup......I don't know any under 30's that run, or own bars or nightclubs. In fact, I hardly know any that have enough of interest to say to keep my attention for more than two minutes......

Man, you're hanging out with some terrible people.

Going to a bar in 30+ doesn't mean you're less mature. I'm 27 and I don't go yo bars often but I go for the drinks n music. This post is from someone who clearly isn't 30+ and will still be going when they reach 30+

Yeah, no problem... when they get to be our age it'll just happen naturally, and they'll join us! LOL

I am going to probably take a lot of flack for this, but there is some truth in what this asshole is saying. His presentation is twisted and reeks of hypocrisy and immaturity, however I see what he is trying to convey. I like to think I am somewhat philosophical, and have often contemplated why is it that gay men focus so much on going to bars and clubs. I may be biased a bit, I've been sober for almost 6 years, however, until I was 50, I was going out a few times a week. I've read a book called The Velvet Rage, and generally speaking (not to say at all that most), gay men are somewhat insecure. The theory the author is presenting is that, we as gay men, are a product of our community and society, and we all have different coping mechanisms to deal with it. Trying to fit in, be with the "in"crowd and have a lot of meaningless friends is common with gay men of all ages. I don't think this has anything to do with maturity, it has a lot to do with conditioning, the need for approval, love and recognition. In other words, many of us are fearful of being alone, myself included. I just completed AIDS Lifecycle, a 545 mile bike ride from San Francisco to Los Angeles, and about 90% of the 2300 riders were 20-30 something. I live in SF, and often witness personally, discrimination and exclusion to older guys, from these 20-30 something guys. That is not true of all, but a rather disturbing large percentage. It is my opinion, again, generally speaking, that these groups of younger guys are the immature ones. They live in a very small bubble, socialize with a limited number of people, thus making them less tolerant, discourteous, hard to approach, and once again, generally speaking, a stuck up fucktard! This guy fits in to that category to the "T". He probably has no life out of the bars, and all of his friends think like he does. This is immaturity, and social retardism. Gay men are going to be Gay men, doesn't matter what age we are. But, I'm pretty sure that many of those young guys won't have a pot to piss in later in life if they don't grow up.

Well I hate to say it as well and will get some slack as well.  But I somewhat agree with what the author is saying and and I agree with your response. 

When people say they are against gay marriage I tell them don't marry the same sex, but they should keep their mouths shut about other people because it is none of their business and rude. If you don't think people over 30 should be going out then you get stop going out at 30 yourself. Thank goodness your opinions don't mean anything to how the real world works. Arbitrary rules meant to alienate and discriminate? We've had enough of that thanks.

I wonder what this little pricks reaction will be when he is over 30 and suddenly becomes invisible to little boys who think they have all the answers.

Heinrich is obviously a little self-righteous egotistical brat who thinks he knows everything about what he hasn't even experienced yet. Not everyone has plans to have a family. Their family is made up of friends old and new. He writes like he knows the inner most thoughts and details of the lives of the people he believes he has the right to pass judgement on. People he's never even met. And why does he care how anyone else dresses or behaves? I think he should learn the age old lesson of keeping his nose where it belongs, in his own business and stop worrying about how everyone else is reflecting on him. He's certainly entitled to his opinions even bad ones. But to think he has the credentials to foist it on the gay community at large is beyond reason. I hope as you yourself, Mr. Heinrich get older and actually gain some experience in something other than indulging your own little theories which really aren't that original anyway, but I digress, I hope you realize that you're not the fountain of wisdom and knowledge that you have come to consider yourself to be. Perhaps you may even learn to respect others for their differences and allow them to behave however they see fit without suffering your ridiculous derisions. Perhaps you may even grow up to be an adult who is kind and not an eternal insufferable brat.

Your 20's are to have conceptions as this young gay man does and think that his opinions matter. Your 30's are to keep bars, clubs and other gay establishments afloat. 

For myself, I have little desire or need for the club scene. Am 61 years old. However, an occasion evening out with friends is still enjoyable, and the scenery of pretty young things is always pleasant. I believe it shows, once again, the lack of support and empathy that gay men are all too good at showing other gay men, be  they more butch, more femme, fatter, older, skinnier, of different race, whatever. We demand acceptance from the the straight community, but are reticent to extend acceptance and support among ourselves. Shame on all who have so little tolerance to others unlike yourselves. And, a reminder to all the young out there who object to an older presence. You would not have the easy life and acceptance (comparably) that you have now were it not for the effort put out and the truly great trials and wrongs experienced by us, the generation that came earlier. Yes, I/we may be fat, bald, behind the latest in trends, fashion, etc, but we too are gay and very proud of it. And we are oh so proud too that many of you young guys will not need to experience what we did. It is part of our gift to you. That, along with the confidence, pride, and pleasure you all may now freely and openly exhibit in your lives. Indeed, we all have a long way to go, but we are aeons from where we were. 

When I was in my 20's, the men I was most attracted to in the bars and clubs were over 30.  At 62, I'm happy not to go where I'm not wanted, and I haven't been inside even a quiet neighborhood bar in more than a decade.  But the implication that every man over 30 is suddenly undesirable is simply factually false.  Even if every 20-something were repulsed by all the 30 and 40-somethings out for the evening, they might be far from repulsed by one another.  Besides, there are bars and bars.  Always were.  If you went to Julius in the Village back in the day, you knew the clientele trended quite a bit older, and if you didn't like that, you didn't go.  Just as you didn't go to Rawhide if you didn't like guys in leather.  And believe it or not, sonny boy, not everybody likes twinks.  It's a good thing there's no standardized testing of general knowledge these days for the young ones who want into a club, but there IS an IQ minimum if you want to talk to me.  When I was under 30, I turned down guys my own age right and left if I was having a nice conversation with an OLD man with good stories.  I'm not saying I'd have gone home with him, but bars aren't ONLY for tricking.  And I was still getting attention from much younger men when I was quite a bit over 40.  Lastly, clubs and bars are not the same thing.  A loud dance club doesn't favor anybody who doesn't look great shaking it on the dance floor, but a quiet bar can play to the strengths of the guy who has brains, wit, and still looks pretty good.  Bars and clubs never were my favorite way to meet people anyway, because they were always full of shallow assholes, like this blogger, who try to take up all the air, rule the roost, "bestow" themselves on lucky you, and make all the rules.  I see not much has changed.  

let me guess their not allowed on regular nights but when there is a benefit show ud be more than welcoming right first off dancers wouldnt make money bartenders would lose money bc of this the club owner is losing money everyone loses in this idea and lets just call it what the fuck it is what is the supply without the demand basic economics all the drinks that 30+ man woulda bought for that 29- attendee equal out to loses for the bar it sends the wrong message and furthermore were outcasted more then enough by the homophobes why strike ourselves from within the only way to advance is together and all this ostracization thats happening its funny he didnt say that those 30+ shouldnt be protesting for marriage equality but any other function there supposed to disappear for its like why cant any group work together without outcasting ppl its fucking disgusting that we cant be content in being the best us we can be instead of trying to find away to be above someone else i bet the bitch that wrote this only wrote it bc a guy picked a 35 yr old over his immature ass -_- how shocking :-/

Wow, this young man has "struck" a nerve in so many gay men (young and old)...All the comments I have read all seem to favor the "older gay guys", who still believe that being gay is a "social" activity in or out of bars/clubs...I am a "youthful" 60 something (YES YOU ARE SEEING CORRECTLY) who enjoys the friendship and in some cases the "admiration" of many in my small college town in the Pacific Northwest...I don't try to be anyone else but myself and my "intimate" circle of friends enjoy that as I do with them...YES, I am attracted to younger men (21 to 35), to the dismay of some in my circle...I tell them that younger men have this innocents and charm about them, that may of us and older gay men seem to have lost...I do agree that NOT all men in this age group, like or even understand the (Spring/Fall) concept...In short, PLEASE GET TO KNOW US AND MAYBE, YOU WILL LEARN A THING OR TWO ABOUT BEING CONSIDERATE, WELL MANNERED, UNDERSTANDING, AND LOYAL...

If your old enough to drink in a bar then your old enough to get used to the idea that you grew up. The rest of your life you will be dealing with the rest of us or you will be facing lawsuits. Learn as you will. Love the boys!.

Here's a thought:  perhaps the author should stop being so judgmental. God knows we have enough of that in our community which wounds many.  That's one way to be a good role model to younger gays. We don't know why or how often these men over thirty are going to bars nor their struggles so how can we judge. Besides, what difference does it make anyway that they're there. Everybody will be over thirty one day. 

Idiot

So let me get this straight, We, as a community have lived all of our lives with society telling us how we should live and now one of our own wants to step in and do the same? No that's not going to happen. I am glad we are starting to see more rights, But for a while now I have felt this new discrimination creeping in. Discrimination from within our own community, and that is if you don't embrace the whole settling down and having a family concept something must be wrong with you. I don't think I would be about it had it been legal my entire existence. I don't think I would want kids or marriage even if I had been straight. I just think any discrimination that comes from within our own community is uncalled for on any level. And I am definitely tired of being treated like my opinion shouldn't matter because I am over the age of 29. I know some of you just want youth and beauty. But youth and beauty always fades, if your lucky.

Pull the MONEY of Gay men over 30 out of those clubs and bars and they won't be there 6 months from now.  What a conceited, uninformed POS.

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